An Observation

[Carrious Darbyshire]

I'm an enlistedman. This means that many decisions that have an impact on the Ordo and my experience within are transparent to me. I understand that there are many things I do not know, many things I do not need to know, and probably a lot more that's pretty boring and I don't care about. What I do know is that there has only been a select number of personnel that have been less active than desireable on the subject of raids.

Now I can see the perspective of raids being unpleasant, even a hassle. What I cannot see is how people that do not lead raids or do not participate expect to goad on those that do. The Ordo Imperialis has a very reasonable policy of gathering a minimum of three raids each SL day; an easily attainable number that should not be difficult to achieve. Time and again, though, the responsibility lies on a very select group of individuals to ensure that this quota is met; regardless of what we would rather do and regardless of what we have on our plate. Your regular raid leaders work pretty hard to push those raids out the door and come back with a victory, if possible, only to find more that requires to be done.

In order to address this as quickly, efficiently, and blatantly as possible I will provide you one of the gifts I most easily provide. Brutal, ruthless honesty. If you are an officer and you have expectations of your men to meet a requirement, you had better be exceeding that requirement yourself. If you are an officer and are waiting for somebody else to take the initiative, you're probably being a shitty officer. If you are an NCO and you are afraid to take command when command must be taken, you should probably be Numerii. If you are in a cadre and have been largely absentee, you should probably find someone more qualified for the job.

If I see leaders asking someone to lead a raid without at least offering to take one themselves, I'm going to call you on that. If I see people that don't raid telling me to raid, I'm probably going to tell you to eat a dick. If I decide to take a break from SL to do something else, because a break is deserved, and I'm called back because leaders are being weak, I'm going to get to the bottom of who is being weak and I promise I will help you fix your problem.

Now if you excuse me, I'm going to go to Arby's to get a couple badass sandwiches, get some beer, and relax.

[Krow Ames]

I'll admit that i need to raid more. Lead more, actually.

[Huttser]

All it would take is thee or four more people to step up to the plate and lead or learn to lead raids and the burden on that select group would be lifted immensely.

Posted via Android.

[Guest Ruin Nefarious]

In order to address this as quickly, efficiently, and blatantly as possible I will provide you one of the gifts I most easily provide. Brutal, ruthless honesty. If you are an officer and you have expectations of your men to meet a requirement, you had better be exceeding that requirement yourself. If you are an officer and are waiting for somebody else to take the initiative, you're probably being a shitty officer. If you are an NCO and you are afraid to take command when command must be taken, you should probably be Numerii. If you are in a cadre and have been largely absentee, you should probably find someone more qualified for the job.

If I see leaders asking someone to lead a raid without at least offering to take one themselves, I'm going to call you on that. If I see people that don't raid telling me to raid, I'm probably going to tell you to eat a dick. If I decide to take a break from SL to do something else, because a break is deserved, and I'm called back because leaders are being weak, I'm going to get to the bottom of who is being weak and I promise I will help you fix your problem.

Please submit an OCA. I'd like to hire you.

[Reinhardt]

I know before I went inactive, some people were pushing me to lead raids more.

I lack the confidence to, and for many reasons I'm not getting into publicly becuase thats not what this post is about.

I am willing to lead them, I WANT to lead them. I just don't feel ready yet.

I am willing, and able to lead raids to places like New Jessie, or even run stress test training in Titan when needed. And have done both on different occasions.

And I do lead defenses as OIC, unless relieved by higher ranks durring major assaults.

But I think this is one of our major issues; NCO's and prehaps even a few officers, dont feel confident enough to lead raids. Confidence can be built but it is hard. The trick is finding the way to do it for each person, and identifying the personality types that you WANT to build confidence in for raid leadership. After all, building it in someone whos confidence is then easily broken, wastes the original effort. Building confidence in someone who lacked it to start, but who will remain strong when shaken, was a good investment.

[SalemAdams Wobbit]

Sadly, I have noticed this myself. I also have attempted to take out a raid myself, and when there wasn't much in the way of attackers available (either too many numbers or to little to be open), I tried to get one army signed off. Now, while I do have experience in leading raids in other militaries, I do not have such within the Ordo Imperialis. When I asked about getting signed off on a raid, after obtaining OIC permision, from two different officers (because one said they couldn't observe and asked me to ask another officer), I was told they didn't feel comfortable signing off on the raid, due to the target. While I understand the reasoning why (they didn't know how my raid record was, which was understandable, and the target was a Tier-2, which I would need their sign off on it anyway), I felt a bit discouraged when a raid was taken out less than half an hour later, and I was afk for a small bit, to take care of some RL stuff that I was planning on taking care of later on.

Now, I know I haven't been around to raid, but I have a damn good excuse, being hospitalized off and on these past few weeks. I know I'm probably a bit rusty on my raid leadership, since the last time I led one was back when I was in my previous military, but there would probably had been a few experienced people on that raid that could had given me advice in private if needed. I can't say what the outcome of that raid would had been, because it didn't happen.

[Guest Ruin Nefarious]

If you want to learn raid leadership traits, participate in ART/lead one team. I will walk you through it. And then I'll buddy up with you during your first few raids. I do not have a lot of time, but I am more than willing to give every drop I have to help!

[Huttser]

Seconding what Aryte said. ART is a sure fire way to help you learn leadership traits. Additionally if Aryte is busy / offline / helping someone else etc, I'm more then willing to help too, I'd much rather teach new raid leaders so they can get raids out then sit there at 5AM my time trying to lead them.

[Deadmon]

One of the most common phrases heard in most organizations and military groups is that the brunt of the labor rests on the shoulders of the middle management or in this case Senior NCOs.

While that is in NO WAY an excuse for officers to leave offensive operations solely to these individuals, there is a large bit of paperwork and management expected of every officer which is why their combat requirements are where they are at. Something many of us need to work on including myself. Though there are "paperwork" leaders who almost completely live in the world of paperwork and management (see:curia officers) and arent expected to partake in combat as a baseline requirement. These people do as much work as any other member and should not be told to "eat a dick" if they are simply suggesting a raid be taken out when numbers on base are high. Orders to take out a raid by those who is it expected of and simply do not =/= a gentle suggestion based on active base members in aim to give people something to do.

Your overall message is true, words that everyone should hear. Leading by example is the best way to lead. Though do not forget the hard work several of our members do on a constant basis to keep the wheels of progress and organization rolling or treat them as inferior or less helpful towards the Ordo as a whole.

[Krow Ames]

Raid leading isn't something you can learn over night, but attending your ART classes and not only following orders during raids, but actually looking at the big picture while the orders are being issued will help you understand some of the intricacies involved. SL combat is simple, but so is Chess.

[Tsume Xiao]

I'm an enlistedman...

Time and again, though, the responsibility lies on a very select group of individuals to ensure that this quota is met; regardless of what we would rather do and regardless of what we have on our plate. Your regular raid leaders work pretty hard to push those raids out the door and come back with a victory, if possible, only to find more that requires to be done...

If I see people that don't raid telling me to raid, I'm probably going to tell you to eat a dick. If I decide to take a break from SL to do something else, because a break is deserved, and I'm called back because leaders are being weak, I'm going to get to the bottom of who is being weak and I promise I will help you fix your problem.

Publicly insulting a general group of people by claiming they are shitty <insert X rank> or that they should be demoted probably won't give you a positive response. No one wants to engage in what should be a fun activity for us all when they are being insulted and told how shitty they are. You also fail to bring any consideration into people's real life schedule or situations.

If you wan't to take time off, take time off. No one forced you to left playing Arma for a week (or whatever you did) to lead raids on any given day. If raid were not taken out, the deficiency would have been noted. Then people would have lead raids to ensure the raids got taken out.

When you go and lead three raids in a row in the early day two things will happen

1. You will feel like you are doing all the raiding when you are simply doing the large amount of raids because you want the raids to be done for the day. Commendable, but you are intentionally wearing yourself out, so in that sense it is to some respect your own fault you feel like you are leading all the raids.

2. People will see that three raids have gone out and therefore not feel the need to lead more. Since they don't lead more, you make yourself seem like you are the only one leading raids, when in reality it is because you have filled the quota so early in the day. Combine with number one and amplify your feelings of "no one else takes raids out". You take away the reason for some people to raid. I can guess that there are people who, when they see the raids done for the day say to them selves "Well now I can finish the other tasks I have to do since the raids are done" instead of "MORE RAIDS WOO!". People have other things to do, so if you fill what would be a top priority (3 raids a day) then the optional assignment (more raids) is left sitting in the lower tiers of their daily checklist.

In other words: Instead of chastising a group for your feelings, part of which are self inflicted, stop. If people see raids must be taken out they will be taken out. Stop overly stressing yourself. Limit yourself to one raid lead a day if you feel the need to lead by example, but let others carry the burden as well. Its like the whole metephor with the horse and mule splitting the load. The mule eventually gets overloaded and the proud horse must carry the weight. Well if the mule had picked up all the load before the journey was underway and hurt himself because of it, the story would have gone a lot differently and wouldn't have had much moral stuff besides "don't overwork yourself".

And since I see the response of "Oh well you don't know what I am talking about/you can't relate to this" coming, I have one simple answer: Bullshit.

Now pardon me while I get on my soap box ammo can to respond while playing the devil's advocate.

Lets look at Tsume for a second shall we? I could have sat and made the same post about how I feel like I have to have my free time interrupted to get things done for Ordo and this and that.

There is however a difference here. If you don't take out three raids a day, no one faults you for it. You don't have to take out all three. Infact, you shouldn't in my opinion. And if three raids don't get taken out, whats the absolute worst thing that can happen? Aryte gets rather upset.

Now lets flip the coin. Unlike you, I really can't take time off. If I do, essential projects can slow down to mush, and I'll be damned if I let people sit and make generalities about how "Munitorum takes forever to do things." Personally, i pride myself on getting shit done quickly, and if I take too long I know that I will lose that credibility and Aryte will start pestering me for things every time I log on. Unlike leading raids, If I don't get shit done, there isn't really anyone else who can do my projects for me. They have their own projects, their own restrictions.

So as for taking time off? Yeah, I don't see that as much of an option. I've bought several games I haven't gotten to play much because I put Ordo as a first priority. Unlike raids, that is rather inflexible for me.

If my tasks were to be equated to raids, they would boil down to the equivalent of a 1 raid a day lead by a Prefectus or Higher. That's what Munitorum often is. Unlike the giant pool of raid leaders, Munitorum has a few staff who all have a large amount of work. I can't stop and have one of them do mine as well.

Hell, there are times when my daily schedule involves classes, study time, dinner, and Ordo work. And then right to bed. Would I like to be playing say, BF3 or Arma or Portal 2 (that I bought two days ago and have been too busy doing Ordo work after studying to actually even install, let alone play)? Absolutely. I even sometimes have to pass on raids to get things done. But I need to get shit done because there is a lot riding on me to get my stuff done. Keep that in mind when you see members of Munitorum spending almost all of their SL time, or non-SL free time, developing or working on gear because there is no other way it would get done. I can't speak for people like Keller and Xoza, but I know that I spend quite of bit of my time doing things from actively scripting to planning out things that need to be-rescripted. I can also guess that there is a similar reason that every time I wan't to talk to Disembodied he takes ages to respond. The first thing that crosses my mind is that he is working on his list of tasks (or grabbing a Lunchable), not that he is slacking off.

And when I do have time and could possibly lead a raid, I get restricted by low base numbers, other raids already being out, or no available targets. That isn't my fault, yet that means I am not "leading raids". As mentioned above, if there are three raids on the board and I have projects that need working on or I have been working on projects all day, I don't see leading another raid out as high on my list.

You have the ability to share the load, yet you choose not to and lead "all" the daily raids yourself, or an unbalanced amount. Hat "all" is sometimes a Hyperbole, but other times not. I have seen you lead three raids in the same day just to meet the three raid thing. I have seen you take out a raid team and go to multiple targets without even returning to Titan. You didn't have to do this, you need to do this. Its cool that you want to, again, commendable, but to turn around and say how you seem to be the only one leading raids without taking the factor of what you are doing and causing, amd then insult others over it. THat's not commendable at all.

So Carrious, go ahead and take a break. You do deserve it and you do work very hard. But remember that there are others who can and will take raids out in your absence.

But at the same time, realize that there are others who also deserve breaks within the officer core, enlisted, and special divisions who may not be able to afford the luxury of an un-interrupted break. You can, but you choose to allow it to be interrupted. Don't fault others for something you allow happen of your own accord.

Now if you excuse me, I need to go make dinner and go lecture at someone who said my ammo can was full of clips.*

(Fun Fact: Ammunition that comes in ammo cans for magazine fed weapons is often loaded on stripper clips that are used to feed the magazines.)

[Aryte]

If people like Carrious (and like three others) didn't lead raids, we'd never be anywhere close to our goal of 3 a day. This is a repeated pattern of a select couple of people bearing the weight of what should be shared between dozens. Additionally, the majority of his post was pointed to the officer staff. Which, I can confirm, does not pull its raid weight up to the standards I have set. Although I can appreciate your intent, you are completely off, Tsume.

[Krow Ames]

But remember that there are others who can and will take raids out in your absence.

At the last minute.

I'm going to do better, myself, but I'm also going to defend Carrious's position on this because he's right.

[George Reisman]

tl;dr

It seemed like Carrious was getting some positive feedback, though.

[Carrious Darbyshire]

Shit happens. If your real life gets in the way, step down. Real life should always take priority and if it doesn't let you hold a position then you probably shouldn't hold that position. I don't know what back ass-wards dimension you're in, but in this one what I say isn't weird. The standards I'm holding officers to is the standards officers should be held to; failure to meet them means you're not a good officer because an officer should be leading by example. I could pretend to kiss an ass but that's not how I roll.

If you want to play the 'me vs. you' game I'm going through a divorce and filling out government paperwork. I haven't seen my daughter since I got out of the army. I give no shits about your problem catching up and how heroic you are for building instead of raiding. Some people are builders. Other personnel we have are admin. There are plenty of staff and leaders in combat positions and roles who aren't doing what they should and that is who this is directed to. Not you.

[Tsume Xiao]

I give no shits about your problem catching up and how heroic you are for building instead of raiding. Some people are builders. Other personnel we have are admin. There are plenty of staff and leaders in combat positions and roles who aren't doing what they should and that is who this is directed to. Not you.

Then perhaps you should make your audience more clear. You included pretty much everyone. Officers. NCO. Enlisted. WIth no forms of specification.

Further more...

Its pretty clear how little few shits you give about what I do because you don't even know what I do. Since you don't give a shit about the hard work Munitorum does then perhaps you should stop using the things we work on until you do.

It's probably worth mentioning that everything you Ffffing use was a result of someone else's hard work. I'm not just talking about myself.

Look at all the models you use for everything in Ordo. Pretty much all of our current worn gear was made by Disembodied.

Look at all the guns you use in Ordo. About half are mine and half are Kellers. Now compare that to how often and how long you see Keller online and think of what else he could be/ would rather be doing. Yet instead, he makes guns.

Look at all the aircraft you complain are never their to give you air cover. Do you have any idea the amount of work that has to go in to a aircraft to make it reliable and combat worthy, let alone have all the features some of ours have? Probably not, but Ethan obviously knows first hand.

Look at all the varied work Xoza has done. I can't even fit him into one category because of the breadth of his work.

Look around the sim at all the aestetic work Nikki has done. Actually, even better, look at the new air superiority fighter she modeled.

Hey, you could always just take off all your armor, guns, HUD's, gear, and go on a raid to one of the shitty looking sims with a shitty freebie gun. Better yet, go to one that doesn't allow teleports and wish you had something like a dropship, APC, or those Telepads.

Then again. Such a raid wouldn't really exist because you can't even go without armor or uniform. So for a true experience, go stand in the middle of some shitty little free-for-all damage sim where you can get blackscreened by a bunch of idiots and experience "combat" without a governing body or structure.

I ment nothing by the post but to show that there are other people who have other obligations that rank higher than leading a raid. If you have real life stuff, then why are you stressing yourself so much to lead raids. I was talking specifically about Ordo stuff and free time. No asked you to play the "me versus you" game.

If you want to be a total dick about things, go do it elsewhere.

[Deadmon]

This doesnt need to be turned into an argument.

Carrious framed an issue of raids which is a true issue. My response wasnt to try and argue with him nor discredit it because its true. I simply wanted to make the point that there are those that are in positions of leadership (or simply enlisted) that spend twice the time many people do raiding (simply because that is their responsibilities not any form of "being better" nonsense) doing less fun activities that are directed at keeping the wheels spinning, and that it shouldnt be taken offensively if they make a simple "hey look theres 23 on base, we should raid?" sorta of thing.

Nobody is better than anybody in Ordo. Different jobs are done by different people. Carrious was essentially making a call to arms for the combat based troops, not damning the entirety of Ordo.

[Aryte]

I'd encourage you to read the Tribunus assignments and realize that concessions have been to accommodate individuals in positions that warrant a more administrative role. Namely, pretty much everyone you listed. I really do not see why you are making a scene over this? Really diluting the whole post and string of agreement. Additionally, kind of blatantly ignored the fact I confirmed his perspective to be truth. If you threaten to "hard code" members of my group out of gear, we'll find new scripters. Your place is not to make that decision. You are making this into a personal matter when it had nothing to do with you.

[Aryte]

Nobody is better than anybody in Ordo. Different jobs are done by different people. Carrious was essentially making a call to arms for the combat based troops, not damning the entirety of Ordo.

[Tsume Xiao]

I'd encourage you to read the Tribunus assignments and realize that concessions have been to accommodate individuals in positions that warrant a more administrative role. Namely, pretty much everyone you listed. I really do not see why you are making a scene over this? Really diluting the whole post and string of agreement. Additionally, kind of blatantly ignored the fact I confirmed his perspective to be truth. If you threaten to "hard code" members of my group out of gear, we'll find new scripters. Your place is not to make that decision. You are making this into a personal matter when it had nothing to do with you.

I posted to make a comment that the audience should be narrowed and that he should look at circumstances.

If this was ment for officers then that should have been stated.

I wasn't the one who turned it into a personal argument, but if someone wishes to undermine the hard work of a division then they need to stop and look at what the division does.

The comment about hard coding was to make a point that if he cannot respect the work done by others that he should not use it and see what happens when it goes away.

Quite frankly, the fact that you would take that as a serious thing disappointments me, and the fact that you would retort with "then will find new scripters" even more so. You know quite well that I don't do childish shit like that.

You acknowledge there are issues with the officer staff. Fine. I can see that.

I was perfectly content with your post of:

If people like Carrious (and like three others) didn't lead raids, we'd never be anywhere close to our goal of 3 a day. This is a repeated pattern of a select couple of people bearing the weight of what should be shared between dozens. Additionally, the majority of his post was pointed to the officer staff. Which, I can confirm, does not pull its raid weight up to the standards I have set. Although I can appreciate your intent, you are completely off, Tsume.

However when a post specifically addresses every rank and chastises them, then the poster specifically turns things into a personal subject and states that he "gives no shits" about the hard work of myself and others, it says to me that they need to be reminded of what other people do for the good of the group, the same people he was just so quick to call out. In fact this whole thread could have been started in a positive light of encouragement rather then telling others they are shit. If you want to have other people turned off form helping out because they are treated like dirt then so be it. I can change and start to "give no shits" too if that is what gets lauded, but I'd rather get work done than insult people and lower the quality of the group atmosphere.

Its a simple comparison between the two when it boils down to it

Case One: "YOU ALL ARE SHITTY OFFICERS NCO'S AND ENLISTED NOT WORTHY OF YOUR RANKS AND ME AND A SELECT FEW DO ALL THE WORK BECAUSE YOU GUYS DONT"

Case Two: "Hey guys. Recently I have noticed that there has been a trend of a certain select few leading the majority of the raids and it can really effect their morale if they seem to be doing much of the work towards our daily raid count. How about we show them that they can rely on us to keep things flowing as well...."

I sure know what would get more people working...

[Carrious Darbyshire]

Your cliffnotes suck. I made very specific if-then statements. You're also derailing this.

[Aryte]

It didn't seem to be humor, Tsume. I took it in the manner it was presented. But there was a string of officers going "yeah I agree," and a series of NCOs going "I want to learn." That was all quite positive and nice to see. So I am not sure if perhaps you simply read things in a different manner, or there's an underlying misunderstanding here? Whatever it may be, both of you take a step back and reassess. There's no room for personal jabs on either side. But the topic Carrious brought forth is quite valid and worthy of note.

[Jeffery Worbridge]

I applaud Mr. Darbyshire's call to action and I would like to begin my response with a quote from one of my favorite America authors:

The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. —Thomas Paine

With that said, there is absolutely no one in this group who is incapable of possessing and giving some sort of skill/talent that is useful to this organization. Do we seriously not learn anything when we step forth as Numerii's and present interest to become an NCO? I do feel that many diverge from this train of thought, that being an NCO is a responsibility—not another rank to obtain. However, Mr. Darbyshire's point of observation holds true for any member within this organization. It does not matter what group, division, activity you're most active in—we as NCOs have an obligation to stand up and lead to the best of our potential, and if you cannot make a serious effort; being an NCO is not for you.

I will admit, I do neglect myself in combat and partaking in raids—and I won't make excuses there. But why are there NCOs in Alpha Squads who do not even take forth the responsibility of being some of the best and the brightest in our organization? I sincerely believe that all of us can ask ourselves, how else can we can serve our organization? If there has never been an opportunity before to step forth as a leader, it is now! If you have never experienced the victory of pursuing a goal by leading troops, you're missing out! If I can share one idea with you all, that I learned from the State Police Academy its; Everyone has the ability to be an emblem of service and integrity.

I truly hope that more of you step forth to your calling here, this organization runs on the dedication of it's members.. I think this is a wake-up call for the lot of us, including myself. I hope we all take a bit of this thread to heart.

Edited May 11, 2012 by Jeffery Worbridge

[Ookamiwulf Lemton]

Great peice of writing there Jeffery.

[Larry Furlough]

I agree that ART is a very big part of learning raid leadership qualities, and it's stressed importance in the process of becoming a great leader is just. However, I do believe a lot of becoming a good raid leader rests in boldness and willingness to step up to the plate, and, as Carrious said, "take command when command must be taken".

I will admit, it is a lot of pressure to lead a raid. Sometimes people can run their mouths, disrespect you, and over-all make you question "Why am I even doing this?!?".

Anyway, I'm straying from the subject.

If you're a Tribunus, you are among the best the Ordo has. You are literally hand selected by Aryte himself to, in a way, lead the entire group. Your leadership traits and conduct rub off on the enlisted and cadets. You're a symbol, really! I believe whole heartily that every officer has nothing but good intentions, and they all have their own assignments and operate with intent to perform them to the best of their ability.

Those assigned to raids, however, I do wish would step up a tiny bit more. I know I have the ability to lead raids, but a Principales such as Carrious should not have a raid count comparable, and at times surpassing, the expectations set for an officer.

Anyway, that's all I got right now. I salute those of you who are taking time to lead your raids as well as those aspiring to better themselves, and those that are not still have my full respect and highest regard. :]

Edit: Jeffery, that's just brilliant. I mean it.

I don't mean for my post to sound like NCOs should not better themselves and do their duties, I mean it to sound like they shouldn't be NCOs any longer if they're performing on the level of an officer. You are very correct about it being a time to further yourself.